You all seem ready to do an ALSUP and try a Plan B meeting, but you are concerned you won't get it right. I thought I would tell you about my first attempt.
I had a student who was in the 5th grade in our self-contained classroom for students with severe emotional impairments. He is pretty bright and was integrating into a general education classroom for some of the day. He didn't like to talk much and would often shut down. The instructional assistant was doing his math instruction one-on-one because he had higher skills than the rest of the students in the class. When the assistant sat down opposite him to instruct, he would put his head down and start mumbling. The teacher and instructional assistant had made an attribution error - their hypothesis about his behavior was off. They thought that he thought he knew enough math and didn't need instruction. They were concerned that if they sent him to the gen. ed. classroom for math, he would never survive. I don't remember all of his lagging skills, but the unsolved problem was "I've noticed you're having difficulty during math (in the self-contained classroom)" - kind of clumped (mistake). I then said "You put your head down and start mumbling" - mentioned the behavior (mistake). So, I had already made two mistakes. It took him a long time to start talking - I kept asking questions, but gave him a lot of silence so that he could process. After awhile, he finally said, "It's just that I can't stand that ssss sound that Miss Langdon makes when she is whispering. And I can't stand the smell of peanut butter. I think she has it for lunch a lot." So, I learned some things that we would never have guessed . . . it is so important to involve kids and listen to them and let them process their thoughts. As Ross Greene mentions, kids aren't always used to being listened to. We were able to solve the problem - the instructional assistant didn't whisper and she moved back and gave him more space. I think she did something about the peanut butter, but I can't remember what it was. In any case the solution was realistic and satisfactory for both parties - a durable solution. All of that to say, you can make mistakes and still learn alot and even solve problems!
One of the students I am trying the on is the one with PTSD from my comments last time. I wonder if Joey in the book ever takes advantage of the situation? My student seems to be doing that now. She needed to talk but now it is going overboard. Instead of running from her problem I would like to see her at least try once or twice to work through it and continue what she is doing. I don't think I made a terrible mistake at the beginning but now I need to meet with her again to discuss things. She now wants me to have lunch with her more often but I do have things to do so she tells me it is really important so I give in. Sometimes I can put her off until later. She even goes as far as to say that the kids sitting next to her reminds her of what caused her PTSD so she needed to move. She has got to start facing some of this with a real therapist. Mom couldn't come to conferences and we set up a time for Friday but then my student got sick and was out Thursday and Friday. My question: Do you set limits right away or just work them out as they come up. I didn't see this coming.
I think the hardest part (so far) for me is trying to figure out which problem to tackle first! I have a student who is very similar to Joey who I plan to do an ALSUP on this week. His outbursts are getting worse as the year goes on, so clearly what I am doing with him now is not effective. His latest included flipping a desk, throwing chairs, and yelling at a police officer. :-0
I don't have much time tonight, but wanted to address you questions/comments- I may not do a very thorough job, so comment back if you need clarification.
Hi Sherry - I never look at kids as taking advantage - I look at it as kids trying to get their needs met. So it isn't so much about setting limits as it is going back to a Plan B to talk about the solution not working. The solution has to meet 2 criteria. Both parties have to be able to carry it out and it has to be satisfactory to both parties. I think you touch on an important point. There are interfering factors that get in the way of Plan B - without knowing all the details of her case, she may well need more support that what she can get in school. I don't know all of your building policies/procedures, but it sounds like you have built a nice relationship with mom so you may be able to discuss counseling/therapy- may be good to talk to Christa to talk through how to bring that up with mom. I am wondering about Child Study Team?
Lindsay - you may want to start with a problem that is interfering most, or you may want to look at a problem that you think you can have more success in solving.
To summarize - Challenging behavior occurs when the demands of the environment exceed the capacity of a student with lagging skills. I will have to do a bit of research, but I think Ross Greene would say that acute trauma or grief may be considered interfering factors. It is not wrong or harmful to use Plan B with a child who is experiencing trauma or grief, but it is a factor that requires more specialized intervention. Even as a school social worker, I encourage parents/caregivers to seek treatment with community resources in these situations.
Sherry, I can tell that you are very passionate about helping your students. I am glad that mom is looking for resources in the community and she seems to understand that it may take a bit of time to find a good fit for her daughter.
I struggle so much with really narrowing down what problem should be dealt with first. I think that if this process was one that was a team effort between all teachers that deal with the student on a daily basis, I would feel much more confident and clear on where to begin. I feel overwhelmed with curriculum, let alone these behaviors! I also spilled water on my book and so it's been trying for the past week. Am I a train wreck or what?!
I am basically posting here, not because I have anything intelligent to say, but to let you know that I'm still kickin'! :)
You all seem ready to do an ALSUP and try a Plan B meeting, but you are concerned you won't get it right. I thought I would tell you about my first attempt.
ReplyDeleteI had a student who was in the 5th grade in our self-contained classroom for students with severe emotional impairments. He is pretty bright and was integrating into a general education classroom for some of the day. He didn't like to talk much and would often shut down. The instructional assistant was doing his math instruction one-on-one because he had higher skills than the rest of the students in the class. When the assistant sat down opposite him to instruct, he would put his head down and start mumbling. The teacher and instructional assistant had made an attribution error - their hypothesis about his behavior was off. They thought that he thought he knew enough math and didn't need instruction. They were concerned that if they sent him to the gen. ed. classroom for math, he would never survive. I don't remember all of his lagging skills, but the unsolved problem was "I've noticed you're having difficulty during math (in the self-contained classroom)" - kind of clumped (mistake). I then said "You put your head down and start mumbling" - mentioned the behavior (mistake). So, I had already made two mistakes.
It took him a long time to start talking - I kept asking questions, but gave him a lot of silence so that he could process. After awhile, he finally said, "It's just that I can't stand that ssss sound that Miss Langdon makes when she is whispering. And I can't stand the smell of peanut butter. I think she has it for lunch a lot."
So, I learned some things that we would never have guessed . . . it is so important to involve kids and listen to them and let them process their thoughts. As Ross Greene mentions, kids aren't always used to being listened to. We were able to solve the problem - the instructional assistant didn't whisper and she moved back and gave him more space. I think she did something about the peanut butter, but I can't remember what it was. In any case the solution was realistic and satisfactory for both parties - a durable solution.
All of that to say, you can make mistakes and still learn alot and even solve problems!
One of the students I am trying the on is the one with PTSD from my comments last time. I wonder if Joey in the book ever takes advantage of the situation? My student seems to be doing that now. She needed to talk but now it is going overboard. Instead of running from her problem I would like to see her at least try once or twice to work through it and continue what she is doing. I don't think I made a terrible mistake at the beginning but now I need to meet with her again to discuss things. She now wants me to have lunch with her more often but I do have things to do so she tells me it is really important so I give in. Sometimes I can put her off until later. She even goes as far as to say that the kids sitting next to her reminds her of what caused her PTSD so she needed to move. She has got to start facing some of this with a real therapist. Mom couldn't come to conferences and we set up a time for Friday but then my student got sick and was out Thursday and Friday. My question: Do you set limits right away or just work them out as they come up. I didn't see this coming.
ReplyDeleteI think the hardest part (so far) for me is trying to figure out which problem to tackle first! I have a student who is very similar to Joey who I plan to do an ALSUP on this week. His outbursts are getting worse as the year goes on, so clearly what I am doing with him now is not effective. His latest included flipping a desk, throwing chairs, and yelling at a police officer. :-0
ReplyDeleteI don't have much time tonight, but wanted to address you questions/comments- I may not do a very thorough job, so comment back if you need clarification.
ReplyDeleteHi Sherry - I never look at kids as taking advantage - I look at it as kids trying to get their needs met. So it isn't so much about setting limits as it is going back to a Plan B to talk about the solution not working. The solution has to meet 2 criteria. Both parties have to be able to carry it out and it has to be satisfactory to both parties.
I think you touch on an important point. There are interfering factors that get in the way of Plan B - without knowing all the details of her case, she may well need more support that what she can get in school. I don't know all of your building policies/procedures, but it sounds like you have built a nice relationship with mom so you may be able to discuss counseling/therapy- may be good to talk to Christa to talk through how to bring that up with mom. I am wondering about Child Study Team?
Lindsay - you may want to start with a problem that is interfering most, or you may want to look at a problem that you think you can have more success in solving.
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteTo summarize - Challenging behavior occurs when the demands of the environment exceed the capacity of a student with lagging skills. I will have to do a bit of research, but I think Ross Greene would say that acute trauma or grief may be considered interfering factors. It is not wrong or harmful to use Plan B with a child who is experiencing trauma or grief, but it is a factor that requires more specialized intervention. Even as a school social worker, I encourage parents/caregivers to seek treatment with community resources in these situations.
ReplyDeleteSherry, I can tell that you are very passionate about helping your students. I am glad that mom is looking for resources in the community and she seems to understand that it may take a bit of time to find a good fit for her daughter.
I struggle so much with really narrowing down what problem should be dealt with first. I think that if this process was one that was a team effort between all teachers that deal with the student on a daily basis, I would feel much more confident and clear on where to begin. I feel overwhelmed with curriculum, let alone these behaviors! I also spilled water on my book and so it's been trying for the past week. Am I a train wreck or what?!
ReplyDeleteI am basically posting here, not because I have anything intelligent to say, but to let you know that I'm still kickin'! :)